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Mercedes-Benz 230 SL 'Pagoda' [W113]

Mercedes-Benz 230 SL [W113] in 55 Degrees North, TV Series, 2004-2005 IMDB

Class: Cars, Convertible — Model origin: DE — Made for: GB

Mercedes-Benz 230 SL 'Pagoda' [W113]

[*][*][*][*] Vehicle used a lot by a main character or for a long time

Comments about this vehicle

AuthorMessage

Sandie SX

2011-04-02 01:17

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1.01
[Image: 296441-Mercedes_SL.jpg][Image: 296442-Mercedes_SL_2.jpg][Image: 296443-Mercedes_SL_3.jpg]

1.03
[Image: 296444-MB_SL.jpg][Image: 296445-MB_SL_2.jpg][Image: 296446-MB_SL_3.jpg][Image: 296447-MB_SL_4.jpg]

1.04
[Image: 296448-MB_SL.jpg][Image: 296449-MB_SL_3.jpg][Image: 296450-MB_SL_4.jpg]

1.06
[Image: 296451-MB_SL.jpg][Image: 296452-MB_SL_2.jpg]

2.01
[Image: 296453-MB_SL.jpg][Image: 296454-MB_SL_2.jpg]

2.05: Some nice scenery too.
[Image: 296455-MB_SL.jpg][Image: 296457-MB_SL_3.jpg][Image: 296458-MB_SL_4.jpg][Image: 296459-MB_SL_5.jpg]
Chase with 2004 Nissan Primera in this episode.

2.06
[Image: 296460-MB_SL.jpg]

As you can tell by the number of pictures I really liked this car though I was somewhat perplexed by the fact a reasonably low ranked detective could afford one...


dsl SX

2011-04-02 01:44

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Sandie wrote I really liked this car though I was somewhat perplexed by the fact a reasonably low ranked detective could afford one...

Agreed and agreed. Totally fake plate - SCW xxx series was not issued, nor xxx SCW; 1st use was SCW xxxK in 1972, much too late for this car. Not even a cherished - so undateable - number, as nothing on check sites.

chicomarx BE

2011-04-02 03:40

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Very nice... I'm sure the idea was to lend sophistication to the character.

ingo DE

2011-04-02 22:05

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chicomarx wrote Very nice...


Not in everyones opinion. The Pagode became a boring mass-nuisance. It is cluttering up too many classic car events. As the W107, Porsche 911, Big Healey, early Ford Mustang and some more, too. Too often owned by people with money, but no feeling and knowledge about classic cars.

wolfmann EN

2011-07-10 19:52

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ingo wrote

Not in everyones opinion. The Pagode became a boring mass-nuisance. It is cluttering up too many classic car events. As the W107, Porsche 911, Big Healey, early Ford Mustang and some more, too. Too often owned by people with money, but no feeling and knowledge about classic cars.


What a ridiculous /envious / ill considered opinion. They are hardly common cars but deservedly popular. I think you will find far more VW Beetles, vans, Triumph Stags, TR's and minis not to mention Golfs at classic car shows.
The Pagoda is neither boring or a mass nuisance. Try not to talk such nonsense and be a little less inflammatory with your mindless comments.

wolfmann EN

2011-07-10 19:56

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P.S. You managed not only to offend Pagoda owners who, in your opinion have more money than taste but in the same stupid tirade 911 owners and enthusiasts too. One of the worlds greatest sportscars ...Ever. It is pretty apparent that you have neither owned nor driven either. Stick to a Trabant, that way we will have plenty of time to avoid you.

-- Last edit: 2011-07-12 16:56:33 (G-MANN)

Nightrider RU

2011-07-10 19:56

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Great deal of first comment on this site.

dsl SX

2011-07-11 17:25

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This could be an interesting discussion to watch. I'll go and get my deckchair and some pop-corn.

ingo DE

2011-07-12 07:02

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wolfmann wrote One of the worlds greatest sportscars ...Ever.

Sorry, but it's no sports car. The technic is just from the W110/W111 Sedans, nothing spectacular.

ingo DE

2011-07-12 07:25

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wolfmann wrote I think you will find far more VW Beetles, vans, Triumph Stags, TR's and minis not to mention Golfs at classic car shows.
The Pagoda is neither boring or a mass nuisance.

Sorry, but you're wrong. A 1974/75 VW Golf in proper, original shape is one of the rarest cars at all. A very rare sight, and if there is one, the interested people are standing around.
Annother important point about classic cars yo don't have in mind. Many visitors of classic car events, especially that ones with a knowledge about them, are interested in cars, they are knowing from the past, which their parents or grand parants had, where they had personal feelings for. So the "Bread-and-Butter-cars", as we say in Germany ("Porridge-cars" in Britain). This goes not for a Pagoda. Nearly noone has such feelings for that.

But magnanimously I'm seeing your aggravation as an evidence for the lack of experience. Visit classic car events and learn it by yourself. You will hear that opinion about Pagodas there, definetely.

As a little sidekick: there are organisators of open-brand classic car meeting, rallyes and other events, which are saying "Yes, we have to limit the amount of Pagodas. Otherwise the other participants and visitors became bored and annoyed."
And it's not for the first time, I've heard that. Btw: I'm busy in the classic car scene since 20 years.

antp BE

2011-07-12 16:26

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Indeed some models are "too common" in classic cars. The 60s Mustang is a good example of that too.
Recently I went to a Chevrolet meeting in Brussels, there were so many identical C2 & C3 Corvettes :/ Luckily there were also a few others :D
(I'll post photos some day on the forum)

-- Last edit: 2011-07-12 16:26:34

G-MANN UK

2011-07-12 16:54

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ingo wrote Many visitors of classic car events... they are knowing from the past, which their parents or grand parants had, where they had personal feelings for... This goes not for a Pagoda. Nearly noone has such feelings for that.


And how do you know that, Ingo? That no one has personal feelings for this car? Just because it's not an affordable ordinary car like the other cars you mention, people come from different backgrounds :p

I know what you mean when you say there's some classic cars you can get a bit bored of seeing so often at events but that does not lower the value of them, or their place in automotive history. I'm sorry, Ingo, but what you're saying is really just your opinion and I agree with wolfmann to some degree (although he is being quite blunt).

ingo wrote Too often owned by people with money, but no feeling and knowledge about classic cars.


Sorry, but that does sound a little bitter/jealous and quite presumptuous. Just because people are well-off and can afford to buy more expensive cars, how does this mean they don't care as much? Yes, there may be people out there who are rich and purchase expensive cars on a whim and then neglect them but it's sheer generalising to look at certain cars (like Ferraris for example) and say "Oh, anyone who owns this is a spoiled rich person who doesn't truly appreciate it" I think this is more the case with new cars rather than older cars (which is what we're talking about here)

In fact I don't really have a problem with people assuming things about rich people (I'm not rich) but you can't take a particular classic car, like this Mercedes Pagoda, and try and devalue it by saying too many people want them and it's only for well-off people.

-- Last edit: 2011-07-12 17:00:59

G-MANN UK

2011-07-12 16:59

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Nightrider wrote Great deal of first comment on this site.


What do mean exactly? Are you being sarcastic - ie. arguing with Ingo is a bad way to start as a member of IMCDB?

Nightrider RU

2011-07-12 17:08

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Not arguing with Ingo (I'm dreaming about serious offence on K70), but arguing in such silly way. Including "mindless","envious" and other. That guy making clown out of himself.

G-MANN UK

2011-07-12 17:11

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Nightrider wrote That guy making clown out of himself.


In your opinion :p I think he was right, if maybe a bit blunt, but then Ingo is very outspoken himself (maybe too much so at times), so why should it be wrong for someone to call him out on something he says?

-- Last edit: 2011-07-12 17:15:14

Nightrider RU

2011-07-12 17:18

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Do you defending obivous troll? :) Saying you value something and subsequently fully understanding what it is that you value are two very different and separate things. Ingo seems to be understanding one. "wolfmann" looks like one, who don't have more than "My opinion" and "you don't understand" in his armory.

G-MANN UK

2011-07-12 17:19

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ingo wrote Sorry, but it's no sports car. The technic is just from the W110/W111 Sedans, nothing spectacular.


He meant the Porsche 911.

G-MANN UK

2011-07-12 17:19

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Nightrider wrote Do you defending obivous troll?


I don't think he's really being a troll. I think Ingo's being the opinionated one. I wonder if these hardcore car enthusiasts like Ingo ever get into rows at events? I remember once reading this interview Malcolm McDowell, who is a Morgan enthusiast, who was saying he got into argument with another Morgan owner about the colour of his car and he ended up hitting him :lol:

-- Last edit: 2011-07-12 17:39:08

Sandie SX

2011-07-12 17:40

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Perhaps Wolfmann is a Pagoda owner?

Obviously, I think he has been a bit blunt but in that case if you put yourself in his shoes you might react in the same way.

I do agree with ingo to an extent though. You are more likely to see a rich person who lacks true feelings drive something like this than a Marina but I don't think we should tar them all with that same brush.

You don't see so many of these in the UK. At classic car events you are much more likely to see ones belonging to the generations either side of it.

Nightrider RU

2011-07-12 17:51

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Sandie wrote

Obviously, I think he has been a bit blunt but in that case if you put yourself in his shoes you might react in the same way.



Well, in this case he's pretty thin-skinned. Also, Imgo don't use to call Pagoda bad car, he just point out one aspect of its existence as "classic" one.

Heh,I use to like pre-'93 Ladas, but I don't care that they never became true classic and most probably will disappear completely in subsequent years.

G-MANN UK

2011-07-12 17:56

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Sandie wrote You are more likely to see a rich person who lacks true feelings drive something like this than a Marina


:lol: Yeah, rich people don't have feelings, not like the less well-off anoraks who actually want to own the much-maligned Morris Marina. (just joking btw ;) )

-- Last edit: 2011-07-12 18:05:01

DynaMike NL

2011-07-12 18:01

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I'm not really into games like "This is a great car!" and "That is a stupid car!". But I must admit that the Pagoda Mercedes is one of the very few of that brand that at least have a very nice design (even though technically it is closer to tractors than to really interesting cars)...

G-MANN UK

2011-07-12 18:03

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How is it close to a tractor? Anyway, since I was a little kid Mercedes has always been one of my favourite ever car brands and I think this is a lovely car. I would still like to own at least one Mercedes in future (even if it's cheap old one), but it would have to be a saloon or a coupe or roadster, I'm not interested in the SUVs or the A-Class or B-Class.

-- Last edit: 2011-07-12 18:13:56

Nightrider RU

2011-07-12 18:12

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DynaMike wrote at least have a very nice design


After Gullwing it's just boring and plain looking.

ingo DE

2011-07-12 18:14

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G-MANN wrote And how do you know that, Ingo? That no one has personal feelings for this car?

By the easiest possibilities:
a) talking with the owner
b) listening, when the owner speaks with other people.

Try it by yourself, when you are visiting classic car events, and you will see, that the percentage of real enthusiasts, like self-restorators, owners since decades, hyper-focussed specialists, etc. is very very small there. At bread-and-butter-, resp. porridge-cars it's totally different.

Neptune US

2011-07-12 18:21

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G-MANN wrote How is it close to a tractor?


Saying that something is "like" a tractor is one way of saying its "common" or even "not very technologically advanced". Although today that’s not a very accurate statement to make, as tractors are packed with the latest electronics and software. Moreover there are farm tractors than can work without a driver (i.e. automaton farming), this is still rather experimental, but is inching closer to full mainstream acceptance.

We will likely get fully autonomous tractors before we get autonomous cars. Just food for thought.

John Deere’s RoboTractor

-- Last edit: 2011-07-12 18:31:06

G-MANN UK

2011-07-12 18:21

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Neptune, I don't mean to be rude, but I was asking Dynamike (just wondered what he meant by "really interesting cars"). And in your comment, the first sentence would have sufficed (don't want to upset you, but you went off on a bit of a tangent, although I can do that myself at times)

Ingo - So what the wealthier classic car owners tend to be like, in your experience?

Nightrider wrote After Gullwing it's just boring and plain looking.


Yeah, but that was a supercar, it's like comparing an SLK (or an SL if you will) to a McLaren Mercedes SLR.

-- Last edit: 2011-07-12 18:28:03

dsl SX

2011-07-12 18:32

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I've finished my popcorn - is it worth getting another tub?

ingo DE

2011-07-12 18:35

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G-MANN wrote Ingo - So what the wealthier classic car owners tend to be like, in your experience?

For sure the percentage of real enthusiasts is smaller there. Very logical: more money, (probable) less time, so you let make the work with the car by professionals and don't get oily fingers by yourself.

What do you think, is the typical clientele of these professional restoration-garages and classic car-traders? For sure not the old daddy, who kept his beloved Hillman Minx or Opel Kadett since decades. Or the freaks, who made their dream about the cars of their childhood come true. Just look on the homepages and magazine-advertises of these companies.

ingo DE

2011-07-12 18:38

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dsl wrote is it worth getting another tub?
Just thumb in it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iENLhkDodfg

ingo DE

2011-07-12 18:41

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Nightrider wrote After Gullwing it's just boring and plain looking.

Something very attractive. Looks like nothing, but with the hammer under the hood: /vehicle_135740-Mercedes-Benz-300-SEL-63-W109-1968.html :king:
/vehicle_365248-Mercedes-Benz-500-E-W124-1993.html

DynaMike NL

2011-07-12 18:42

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Neptunes answer is exactly what I meant: in my opnion MBs are technically extremely conventional (and boring). I've never driven the Pagoda, but I did have several rides in its successor: great quality, but nothing else to be enthusiastic about... boring engine, bad suspension, bad seats, primitive rear wheel drive. It really felt the same as driveng a MB delivery van.
Of course I prefer strange machines like Panhard, 2CV, DS, Tatra, V-engined Lancia, maybe even DKW. But sadly, modern cars are all just boringly perfect...

DynaMike NL

2011-07-12 18:44

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Ah, I forgot the NSU Ro 80...

ingo DE

2011-07-12 18:44

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dsl wrote I've finished my popcorn

[:heink] Hopefully you haven't missed http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gB-sV4mDuw&feature=related
or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP7aNuqp_YU&feature=fvwrel

G-MANN UK

2011-07-12 18:47

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ingo wrote Very logical: more money, (probable) less time, so you let make the work with the car by professionals and don't get oily fingers by yourself.

What do you think, is the typical clientele of these professional restoration-garages and classic car-traders? For sure not the old daddy, who kept his beloved Hillman Minx or Opel Kadett since decades. Or the freaks, who made their dream about the cars of their childhood come true. Just look on the homepages and magazine-advertises of these companies.


Well, I agree with you there. You've explained it better now (although I'm slightly confused about who you mean by the "freaks" comment), but at first I thought you were being resentful of well-off people and saying that be a real enthusiast you had to be one of these people who are total obsessives, who spend most of their free time on it and whose house/garage is full of stuff and they keep a number of cars of varying condition as "projects" (taken to the extreme these might not be people you'd want to live next door to :D )

-- Last edit: 2011-07-12 19:02:06

G-MANN UK

2011-07-12 18:52

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DynaMike wrote Neptunes answer is exactly what I meant: in my opnion MBs are technically extremely conventional (and boring)... I prefer strange machines like Panhard, 2CV, DS, Tatra, V-engined Lancia, maybe even DKW. But sadly, modern cars are all just boringly perfect


Oh I see, I thought you meant the design of the Pagoda was primitive. I feel a bit bad now for shutting Neptune up. Sorry Neptune.

-- Last edit: 2011-07-12 18:57:01

Gomselmash11

2011-07-12 18:54

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:o what a discussion... i prefer a Rastrojero, better (?)

DynaMike NL

2011-07-12 18:55

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Hahaha

Sandie SX

2011-07-12 18:55

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ingo wrote
For sure the percentage of real enthusiasts is smaller there. Very logical: more money, (probable) less time, so you let make the work with the car by professionals and don't get oily fingers by yourself.


As I've said I do agree to an extent but the problem I have is that I am a complete mechanical incompetent. Am I less of an enthusiast because I have someone mend the car for me so that the whole thing doesn't disintegrate around me after a mile?

That said, ideally I would buy a fairly tidy classic that would not need any work but could give me moderately reliable transport.

Neptune US

2011-07-12 19:01

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G-MANN wrote ...I feel a bit bad now for shutting Neptune up. Sorry Neptune.


Its okay, I’m use to it... :D

Nightrider RU

2011-07-12 19:03

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G-MANN wrote

Yeah, but that was a supercar, it's like comparing an SLK (or an SL if you will) to a McLaren Mercedes SLR.


It was direct predcessor and somehow originator of SL-klasse. So that how I see it: supercar was replaced by ordinary-looking, relatively low-tech and not so hi-performance car.




Nightrider RU

2011-07-12 19:04

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ingo wrote
Something very attractive. Looks like nothing, but with the hammer under the hood



I prefer 6.9. Because it have larger engine and I like W116 design more.) I'm not fond of stacked headlights anyway.

ingo DE

2011-07-12 19:15

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Sandie wrote but the problem I have is that I am a complete mechanical incompetent. Am I less of an enthusiast because I have someone mend the car for me so that the whole thing doesn't disintegrate around me after a mile?

Due this fact the classic car-hobby became really interesting and inflames it very well ;) I'm same, also not really familar with qualified mechanical work. To avoid spening horrendous money to professional companies, what are you doing then? Yes, building up your own network, with capable fellows with the same interest. With friends with the same hobby it makes much more fun. Okay, there are always lonesome (better say: autistic) cowboys, but good connections, often real friendships, are holding and keeping the hobby alive for a long time, sometimes for decades. So you became an established enthusiast automaticially.

G-MANN UK

2011-07-12 19:22

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With modern cars though, isn't it true that there's many things you can't fix on your own (because it requires specialist equipment or computers?)

ingo DE

2011-07-12 19:31

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Sure. To be correct: nearly nothing you can make by yourself any more. Sometimes not even changing the bulbs.

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