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1954 Thames ET6 4D Class: Trucks, Tow-truck — Model origin: 
![[*]](/res/star.png){kind=small}
Minor action vehicle or used in only a short scene
Comments about this vehicle| Author | Message |
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◊ 2014-02-05 13:33 |
http://www.flickr.com/photos/82420162@N07/7991139529 |
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◊ 2014-02-05 16:44 |
1948 is incorrect. The 4-D Diesel engine was not introduced until 1954. |
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◊ 2014-02-05 17:27 |
Compared to other ET6 entries this is an early grille without intermittent chrome highlights (which is supposed to be 51+), but has the D grille badge (which seems to be entered as 4D whenever spotted, although comments say 6D also applied). We have several other plain grille with D badge examples. So there is a contradiction somewhere - either chrome highlights were a year or two after 54, or the D badge was earlier than 51, or that badge means something else, or?? |
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◊ 2014-02-05 23:08 |
The D badge indicates that the vehicle is fitted with the Ford diesel engine, which was introduced in 1954. Previous to that, the diesel option was a Perkins, when the Perkins rings may have been added, or for petrol the Ford V-8 or 4 cylinder petrol engines. |
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◊ 2014-02-05 23:31 |
.... so what does the grille badge here mean? And how/why does it occur on pre-51 grilles (without the shiny highlights)? Does it just mean diesel (made by whoever)? If so, we may need to abandon all 4D referencing and just have ET6 and ET6 Diesel?? |
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◊ 2014-02-06 09:33 |
The D badge indicates that the vehicle is fitted with a Ford diesel engine, either 4D for the four cylinder, or 6D for the six, and was added to the trucks when one of such engines were fitted and not before 1954 when the engines were introduced. CCMV commercial vehicles website says: - "The petrol-engined Fordson Thames ET6 (side valve Ford V8 or 4-cylinder Cost Cutter engine) and Perkins diesel-engined ET7 were first introduced in 1947, 'ET' standing for English Truck. From 1957 when the Fordson name was dropped and became Ford again, the Fordson Thames ET6/ET7 models became the Thames 500E/502E." So there are a few issues to think about here. The 4D and 6D badges carried on into the Trader series. The other points are: - I have no idea about the significance or otherwise of chrome strips http://ccmv.aecsouthall.co.uk/p366663644/h31dd355d#h31dd355d http://ccmv.aecsouthall.co.uk/p366663644/h13019f11#h13019f11 http://ccmv.aecsouthall.co.uk/p366663644/h5fff745e#h5fff745e The presence or absence of the "A Ford Product" flash on the bonnet at the forward end of the side panel The fact that this is a several year old junk yard mule that could have had who knows what bits added or fallen off. -- Last edit: 2014-02-06 09:52:12 |
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◊ 2014-02-06 09:36 |
Don't think the old ET7 / 502E ever had the 6D , though it doesn't matter because 4D never part of the model designation. .gif ":)") The pre 53 diesels ( ET7 ) with Perkins engines had the Four Rings Perkins Badge . Seen many 4D badged without chrome on grill , perhaps just a later styling change . -- Last edit: 2014-02-06 09:53:25 |
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◊ 2014-02-06 11:50 |
 JCB check this, you wanted crawler /vehicle.php?id=421842 |
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◊ 2014-02-06 12:56 |
Any clue what this looked like? |
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◊ 2014-02-06 14:24 |
See my third link above. |
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◊ 2014-02-06 14:58 |
http://www.tractorpanelsbadges.co.uk/shop/vclose1.asp?prd=123188&cat=4335 |
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◊ 2014-02-06 15:21 |
This months Heritage Commercials has a very good Fordson ET ( = English Truck ) history , which explains all the model history and has picture of Perkins models all sporting 4 rings . However just looked at old 1950 roadtest of Perkins model and it says no visible signs ! so maybe optional? ] ![[Image: et7.1.jpg]](http://pics.imcdb.org/3808/et7.1.jpg) -- Last edit: 2014-02-06 15:28:59 |
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◊ 2014-02-06 18:09 |
A while back I made a decision to restrict my magazine buying as I really had better uses for the money. (Voracious Bentley, Mercedes, and that's only two of my grandchildren!) I now only ever buy Classic Bus and The Automobile. Since I never throw any magazines away I still have a lot to read. |
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◊ 2014-02-07 00:40 |
Sometime ago I picked up a reference that chrome grille highlights were 51+, but I can't find it now - not being a lorryist, it was probably in one of our pages. On that basis I cleaned dates to 48 (plain grille) or 51 if chrome present, and also added 4D whenever there was the obvious grille badge (as here). So once we've sorted what's going on, there'll be some readjusting needed. Pottering about inexpertly on googled sites. it seems that ET6 was petrol and ET7 was diesel. Looking through our selection, I've only found one convincing possibility for a non-solid Perkins 4 ring logo - /vehicle_393958-Thames-ET6-4D-1948.html - which does not seem enough. We also have a few shiny enamel 4D badges which are obviously legible as such. Plus a lot which have the same size badge apparently without enamel and illegibly dull - so are those 4D (as I'd assumed) or something else?? As for the presence or absence of the "A Ford Product" flash on the bonnet at the forward end of the side panel (as jfs above) seems most common when visible with later plates from 54 onwards. Chrome grille highlights occur with and without grille badges, and with and without the Ford Product flash - could it instead be a model identifier (although it seems present on all the later examples)?? |
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◊ 2014-02-07 09:42 |
I only buy the classic commercial magaziness when I see something interesting . I got sick of seeing endless rally scene picture of trucks on grass . I would say Vintage Roadscene is the best but now they have started featuring bloody rally pictures!I used to keep all my magazines but I hardly ever referred back to them so got rid of the lot, specially with the advent of the internet and all its info . Local Charity shops are quite keen on them as quote 'they don't get much man stuff '! This edition was passed on to me and its very good on Fordson ET. One of the pictures with the 4 Rings symbol is a road test model belonging to Ford MO CO so I believe these badges were fitted to Perkins ET7 's. Another fact stated is they changed the designation to 500E /503E in 1953 when the new Ford diesel 4D engine became available. But does it matter ?? ask any classic truckie in UK what this is and they will say its an ET6 wether its a 1948 or a 1961 petrol or diesel . -- Last edit: 2014-02-07 09:49:58 |
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◊ 2014-02-07 09:47 |
The first link I posted above shows a 1959 horsebox with what looks like a 4-D badge and no chrome highlights. Details like these, and the Ford Product flash, which I always thought was there to tell you who built the Thames, are small and easy to change so it is difficult to pin them down, especially when a lot of the pictures in the interweb are taken at old vehicle shows and shiny bits could have been added by proud owners. If you look closely at the early Thames badges it may say "Fordson" above the word Thames, when this product name was abandoned (1957 for trucks?) the Ford Product appeared.....sometimes. Apart from 4-D and 6-D and Perkins rings the only other badge I recall was Costcutter, and that was not very often seen, presumably the four cylinder petrol engine was a bit underpowered. -- Last edit: 2014-02-07 10:00:04 |
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◊ 2014-02-07 10:32 |
Heres the Perkins 4 Ring badged models , A FoMoCo one on magazine road test and another one loaded with Bond mini cars ! -![[Image: misc203736.jpg]](http://pics.imcdb.org/3808/misc203736.jpg) ![[Image: misc203536.jpg]](http://pics.imcdb.org/3808/misc203536.jpg) -- Last edit: 2014-02-07 14:23:49 |
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◊ 2014-07-30 19:28 |
Conclusions to date from past 'Commercial Motor' reports and adverts. (1) 'Fordson Thames' ET6 Introduced September 1949 (2) June 1950 'Thames' replaces 'Fordson Thames' which lasted only 9 months. (3) Fordson Thames ET6 as first introduced in September 1949 clearly shows the three chromed highlights on alternating grille bars. Why some or any trucks should be missing these bars is not clear. (4) Perkins 6 cylinder diesel introduced September 1951 on 5-tonner. Perkins 4 cylinder not fitted by Ford on 1½-ton, 2-ton or 3-ton trucks. Some conversions to petrol engined models were however carried out. (5) The side-bonnet chromed 'flash' badge was added in November 1953 with the Ford 4-cylimder "Cost Cutter" petrol engine on 1½-ton, 2-ton or 3-ton trucks. (6) The side-bonnet chromed 'flash' badge was added prior to or during March 1954 to Ford diesel 4D and 6D engines. (7) '4D' 4 cylinder Ford diesel engines were used on the 1½-ton trucks and vans (single rear wheels), 2-ton trucks and vans also 3-ton trucks. (8) '6D' 6 cylinder Ford diesel engines were used on the 5-6 tonner. |
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