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1983 Bedford TL Guinness

1983 Bedford TL in Veronica Guerin, Movie, 2003 IMDB

Class: Trucks, Simple truck — Model origin: UK — Built in: IE

1983 Bedford TL Guinness

Position 01:19:38 [*][*] Minor action vehicle or used in only a short scene

Comments about this vehicle

AuthorMessage

dsl SX

2020-12-31 01:05

DZG883

Bedford KE, 1983
Body: Open lorry & container
Engine CC: 0
Fuel: Diesel
Colour: Blue

What does KE mean??

Sandie SX

2020-12-31 01:09

Definitely a genuine Guinness truck? Seems a bit old for that and not sure it should be in extra info for a movie fake...

-- Last edit: 2020-12-31 01:12:52

Sunbar UK

2020-12-31 14:25

TK 1000 [KE] from 1974 to 1986, 9.84 Ton 4x2 also I believe available as low-load height 6 wheeler for brewers dray use.
[Image: tkkb-ke.1.jpg]
edit: TK KB-KE brochure cover added.

Dodgy number plate not applicable to TL?

-- Last edit: 2020-12-31 22:30:55

dsl SX

2020-12-31 17:12

Just to make life interesting, it could - in theory at least - be a local build if earlier than 1984 when Ireland joined EU and local car/truck assembly stopped. Bedford dates/models unknown, but very active in 60s/early 70s; Vauxhall builds seem to have stopped in 79 when GM reorganised local arrangements and re-introduced Opel for cars.

Gag Halfrunt UK

2020-12-31 18:36

Ireland joined in 1973, same as the UK.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_enlargement_of_the_European_Communities

dsl SX

2020-12-31 19:24

Ooops - I probably mean the Single Market regime in 84; all Irish car builds stopped in 84.

Gag Halfrunt UK

2021-01-02 20:16

The Single Market came into effect in 1993.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Single_Market#History

Perhaps Ireland reduced import duty in 1984.

dsl SX

2021-01-02 20:50

Whatever the 84 regime change was, it was a biggie. Everything stopped abruptly - all the remaining big names - Ford, Renault, Mazda, Fiat, Nissan, Chrysler, Austin-Rover, Toyota - pulled the plug together along with tiddlers such as Daihatsu, after which there was nothing at all for cars. There may have been a smaller regime change in 77/78/79 behind the disappearance of a few names at that point, such as VW, Mercedes, Peugeot and Vauxhall.

Unfortunately no useful info on what may or may not have happened for commercials, which was the starting point of this ramble through the heather.

Bux_48 IT

2021-01-02 21:44

@dsl may I ask you what models did Fiat and Renault build in Ireland in the 80s? Thanks in advance ;)

dsl SX

2021-01-02 22:36

Sorry - can't tell you as my book does't give consistent info. Fiat build started about 1948 and has mentions from 1950s onwards for 500C, 600, early round-boot 1100; 1960s - 600R (?), 850, 1100R, 124; 1970s - 127, 128 and maybe 132. Text says there were also FBUs (Fully Built Up) imports alongside local build which was usually basic versions with limited spec/colour choice only. FBUs were mid and high spec versions. Production reached 12715 in 1977, falling to 4293 in 1984 when it all stopped. Seems this was actually a project owned and run from Fiat HQ in Turin, which was unusual for Ireland as most other assembly arrangements were franchise contracts with local companies. There was also a separate franchise to build Polski 125s 1976-81, total 612 cars made. No obvious references found for Ladas or Yugos.

Renault started 1935-39 with a handful of unknown types, then resumed about 1955. Models mentioned are 750 (4CV), Dauphine and 4, but I guess there were several more (8?, 5?, 16?, 9?, 11?, 18?) as they had 10% of local market at one stage - peak was 1979 with 9639 units, falling to 4824 in 1984 final year.

Irish car story is fascinating mix of full enterprises and all sorts of penny number weirdoes - TVR, Marcos and Mini Marcos, Berkeley, Borgward, Wartburg, DKW, Messerschmitt, Heinkel, Panhard, Skoda, Armstrong-Siddeley, lots of US makes (including even some 1930s Grahams and Hupmobiles) etc in a long list.

Bux_48 IT

2021-01-02 22:44

Very interesting. Thank you really for your response! :)

Sunbar UK

2021-01-02 23:05

"McCairns Motors, assemblers and distributors of Bedfords in the Irish Free State (later the Republic of Ireland) for over forty years, "
http://www.nationaltransportmuseum.org/commercial.html National Transport Museum of Ireland.

"Vauxhall cars and Bedford commercials were assembled in Santry by McCairn's Motors." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_Ireland

"Tariff systems weren't compatible with the Common Market that Ireland joined in 1973 and it was agreed to end the CKD system by 1984"
Review of the book, “Motor Assembly in Ireland” by Bob Montgomery Link to "www.completecar.ie"

Bedfords assembled perhaps until the late 1970s mid-1980s????

dsl SX

2021-01-02 23:43

Sunbar wrote “Motor Assembly in Ireland” by Bob Montgomery

Yup - that's my book. It's fascinating ...

dsl SX

2021-01-02 23:48

@Bux-48 - dug out a different book source - not as good, but says about 1983 Fiat was 127 and 128, and Renault was just 4 and 4 Light Van; in 1976 Fiat had been again just 127 and 128, but Renault was 4, 6, 8, 10, 12 and 16.

Sandie SX

2021-01-03 00:05

Link to "www.rte.ie"

From 4:45 on. Seems to suggest that most named above had stopped before 1984 rather than there being an overnight stop in 1984, this is from February 1984 and specifically refers to Ford stopping imminently and says only Renault and Mazda remained.

Interestingly they say that a lot of the R4s built in Wexford were exported to places such as Spain and Italy. It seems to imply that Ireland probably received imports as well as local builds with the Irish plants being a means to persuade the government to allow their products to be sold?

As well as Ford and Renault, Daihatsu are mentioned specifically and only built cars from 1979-81. Think as a contemporary source it's probably more accurate than the book?

-- Last edit: 2021-01-03 00:27:47

Bux_48 IT

2021-01-03 00:06

Thank you! They kept 128s until the end of Italian production (September 1983). Interesting selection ;)

EDIT: Didn't imagine that we got some Irish built R4..maybe there was a surplus of production in Ireland?

-- Last edit: 2021-01-03 00:35:02

dsl SX

2021-01-03 01:23

Digging a bit deeper, as overall context it seems that since late 40s Ireland had strong tariff protection designed to encourage local assembly and penalise FBU imports, although there were also mutual tariff reduction agreements with UK. When Ireland joined EEC, it negotiated a 10 year dispensation to maintain these tariffs to protect its industry until 84, after which it could not offer any protection, so the industry collapsed as its small-scale couldn't compete on cost against bigger production sites elsewhere in Europe. So it was cheaper for Ford, for instance, to stop making Sierras in Cork and bring them in from UK or Genk.

The theme of keeping things going in Ireland with stuff which was obsolete elsewhere seems strong - R4, Fiat 127/128 as mentioned, also the Peugeot 404 until 1979 - apparently the last place globally to make saloons apart from Nigeria, Chrysler Hunters 76-79 after UK production ended. And within those boundaries, Ireland did export some of its old stuff in late 70s back into UK (eg those Hunters) and Europe (R4s again, presumably the 404s). Plus apparently supplying large numbers of late 70s Escorts to UK (maybe in a similar scenario to Senneffe supplying BL stuff to UK to cover lengthy production breaks during strikes??).

Daihatsu - both the book and the TV report actually end up with the same basic story that the boom was 79-81, reaching 1980 peak of 1640; 1982 figure was 17, 1983 - 6 and 1984 - 7.

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